If There Is No "Me", Then "Who" Is Witnessing?

Ilona:

Hi, let's start from you describing where exactly you are at the

moment.  Do you exist?

DC10:

Thank you.

Do I exist?

I know there is no me.  Never has been, never will be.  I've done

enough work or thinking/meditating on this to really know this is the

truth.  But then "I" get trapped by negative thoughts.  I'm sure you’ve

 heard this 100's of times, maybe 1,000's!  It's "understanding" that there

 is no such thing as "me", but I can't seem to  get "to" the gate, never mind crossing through it....I don't exist as a separate entity, no.

In reading one of the posts on the One On One board, LetMeIn responded to someone's response, which was "similar" to mine by saying, "so you understand the concept but have not seen it". I think that describes where I am. What a great site!

Ilona:

I know exactly where you are......staring at the gate, unable to cross...

there is no gate.....and there is no you to cross.  Crossing happens by

itself.  It is happening now, just notice.....noticing happens too.

Is there a witness or is witnessing happening?  Tell me what you've

got.

DC10:

Is there a witness or is witnessing happening?

Hmmm....I'm truly not sure.....I feel there is a witness watching all this happen, but that may be due to my Buddhist background?  Maybe this is a sticking point for me.  If there is no "me", then "who" is witnessing?

I'm feeling yes and no and I know that is not really a great answer, but that is what is coming....

Ilona:

Look here, there is reading happening, focusing happening, seeing

happening, what is behind all this?  Is there a separate entity

watching this?  Or is it just a thought passing by, I am witnessing...

Can I do anything?

Answer when you are 100% sure.

DC10:

Ha!  Of course!  There is just another thought "I" am witnessing, no different than, "I" am writing, "I" am walking, "I" am breathing, I am bad, good, etc......When you put it that way, it's so obvious.

Perfect.

Ilona:

So is there a you as a separate entity at all?  Was there ever?  What is

the I then?

DC10:

So is there a you as a separate entity at all?

No, there was never really a separate entity....."I" was  given a name, told I was a boy, sometimes good, sometimes bad, "I" was conditioned to believe in a separate "me" from my family, teachers, friends and society.....and of course, I had no reason not to believe in "me" at that point.

Was there ever?

No, looking back I know that now. The conditioning runs SO deep, right through the bones. People, places, events "appear", but as a separate entity, "I" have never really been there.  Maybe that's why we feel the same inside, as our bodies age, we don't feel different inside, cause there is no one there inside to feel any different?  I've always felt that way, but never looked at it from that "view"...or "no view".

What is the I then?

The "I" is a bundle of thoughts and conditioning.  Though when in emotional or physical pain, it sure feels as if there is an "I" experiencing it. (which is what I'm going thru now) It feels that way when "I' take the pain "personally", which I tend to do, even when I "know" there is no one that the pain is happening to.  I know it's just "pain happening", and I need to get past the taking it as a personal

"I".   I know the pain will still be there, but will be much reduced when I know, really know, that's it's just pain, happening to no one.

I hope I didn't over explain my point, Ilona.....

Ilona:

No no, it's great.  Just rant about everything.

So how does it feel to be liberated?

DC10:

So how does it feel to be liberated?

If you're asking me, personally how it feels to be liberated, I don't know.  I don't believe I am there yet.  If you're asking, as I've heard you ask before, what should liberation feel like?

A liberated human behaves like all of "us" but is not attached to anything that happens.  Events come and go and though some can be seen as good or bad, to the  liberated, they are simply events "happening".  Neither good nor bad, nor necessarily do they have much to do with him/her. There's no one to judge.

I guess from my perspective, that's what it should be like. Life's events don't stop happening.....life is living itself, as a matter of fact, quite well, from the perspective of being truly free of the self.....as Buddha said so well, "Deeds are being done, but there is no doer." Life is being lived, but there is no "one" living it.

You gave me permission to rant, so this is how I feel this moment, Ilona.....

I want peace.   Real ever lasting peace.....freedom from this treadmill of self-ing.  It's so tiring and pitiful, actually.  I want to be free of judging and seeing myself in a negative light.  Sometimes I wish I knew nothing of this, then I wouldn't beat myself up over my suffering as I should "know" better.  Is ignorance bliss?  I don't want to think so.

I know it's a form of insanity or craziness to believe both things at the same time, but that is where I am.  The times that I am in the "no me" zone are the happiest most freeing times of my life.....then I drift back to the "real" world (problems, self-pity, bills, etc, etc....) and it all comes back.  You said it PERFECTLY once, ."The world is real, YOU are not."  Simple, yet perfect.  Why can't I hold on to this? 

Why can't this TRUTH "stick"??  I know what you're going to ask, as I've sort of "studied" your writings....

.

"What is the fear that is keeping me stuck.....what's behind the fear...."

Ilona:

It's ok, all good, almost there. This liberation thing is happening.  Just

notice.  There is no you to believe thoughts.  Thoughts like 'this is bad,

this is good, this is how it should be' are simply appearing and

disappearing effortlessly.  There is no you to think them.  There is no

you to believe them.  There is no you that is crying for help.

This has nothing to do with belief.

Tell me, what can be known 100% present.  Look at thoughts and

Notice -  thoughts are real, the content isn't.

And yes, what is behind that fear?  Allow that fear to just be there.  Is

there a you to even allow it?

Notice how all is just happening.  Trusting this process is surrendering.

DC10:

Hi Ilona,

I will answer your questions, but I wanted to share something with you that happened recently.  I'd been dating this woman for close to a year and we recently decided to end the relationship. I've been having a tough time with it, till our talk.  Whether it's through us working together, I'm not sure......but for the first time in a while, I really feel ok about the situation.  It just hit me that "this is perfectly ok....any sadness you feel is nothing more that a thought....completely unreal.”

Who is there to be sad?....it was a very strange, almost an "out of body" experience, cause for the first time, I felt like there really, truly, was "nobody home"....no one to be hurt. I went to bed feeling that way and sure enough, I feel the exact same way right now as I write this at 8:45 am.  I'm very happy about it, but not in a "Yay! Look what ‘I've’ done....or look how far ‘I've’ come way.".....it's sort of a quiet "non-event". Not sure how to deal with it, but I do like this feeling or way of "being"....

I know that's a bit off topic, but I HAD to share.....

Thank You Ilona….

Ilona:

It's not off topic at all.  This story is here as a natural flow of things.

It's great to hear that there is 'nobody home' to get upset....this  is

great.  All that does not serve anymore is starting to fall off, and all

that is true is falling into place.  Trust that.  I call this process Falling.

There is nothing to hold on to and no one to hold on.  All is just

happening.

Thank you for sharing.  Now back to the questions. :)

DC10:

Tell me, what can be known 100% present. Look at thoughts and

notice, thoughts are real, the content isn't.

What can be known 100% is that our life is made of thoughts and you do not have to  believe them.  I've noticed that a LOT today as I really paid attention since I've had that "breakthrough" yesterday that I talked to you about.

Every time something came up, for instance...."Why did we break-up?   Did I do something wrong?  Why did this happen?"  When I step back and look at those feelings and what is behind them, I find they are nothing but thoughts.  Completely made up in my head, from who knows where?   It takes the personal sting out of them immediately. 

Things "happened".  Just like how the sun came out today, then it rained a bit.  No difference.  I'm a little disheveled as I don't know why I don't feel any connection to  the pain, this is very new.

Yes, thoughts are real....you can't deny that, as they constantly come and go.  It's when we create the stories around the content and  believe them that the stories seem real.  We give them their life.  It seems I've been spending my entire life believing in a lie....a fiction....a  "woe is me sad story". (at least that's "my" story....and  I'm not sticking to it!)

And yes, what is behind that fear?

I'm afraid of losing the "progress" that I've "seemingly" made.  I feel I'm "really getting it" this time and my fear is that I’ll somehow slip back.....maybe for no reason or something perceived as "bad" or "upsetting" will happen and I'll revert back to the "poor me" story.   I don't want that.  I don't want to go back there. (I know there is really no 'where' to go, but I'm sure you know what I mean.)

I somehow feel "safe" here in this forum talking with you and like minded people, but "out there" in the world, I want to still live from the place of "nobody home".  I'm hoping this forum has a support type system in place in case of slipping back.....Do you ever slip back once you feel you really "know it"?  Does it stay?

Allow that fear to just be here.  Is there  a you to even allow it?

When I allow the fear to be there, it goes right to your second sentence. I feel there  is not a me to allow it.  Right now I feel so secure in my "knowing".  I don't have to do anything.  It's right here, where it's always been.  Sometimes I find myself laughing out loud at how obvious it is. (I am right now...).....Still........I have the  little devil on my shoulder that whispers that this won't last.  Actually, that's not completely true....the  little devil is NOT there whispering doubts in my ear, but I "imagine" that he is going to show up at some point.  Maybe this is the remnant of "me" trying to hold on?  Could that be it?

Notice how all is just happening.  Trusting this process is surrendering.

That's exactly what I need to do.  Trust.  Trust this process. (which I do!) I told a friend of mine today that I've made more progress in knowing who I really am in the past week, than I have in over 25 years of meditating.  I don't say that lightly, as I love my meditation practice.  I still do.....in fact, my meditation is even better without "me".  It's much deeper and by not giving my thoughts the attention they want makes it much more efficient as well.

Where do I go from here, Ilona?  How do I trust more?  Just by "trusting" I take it?  How can I be sure this is real and is going to stay?  There a lingering doubt of this lasting way back in the dark corner of my conditioned mind.

Ilona:

You are right here, looking at it.  Now just a final push.

Look for yourself, is it true, that there is no 'me'?  Let the truth be

revealed.

Once you find out that Santa is not real, can you believe that it is ever

again? Doubt can come up and it does.  But what has been seen, can never be

unseen.  And yes we gave aftercare group on Facebook. :)

So... how does it feel to be liberated?

DC10:

Look for yourself, is it true, that there is no 'me'? Let the truth be revealed.

Of course there is not a real "me".....right now, that sounds ridiculous.....I mean, what would a real "me" look like??  Santa Claus is a  great analogy.  Once you "know" he's not real, how could you believe in him again?  You would not be sincere if you said you did.....How could there possibly be a me?  When you look at it in the right way, right between the eyes, no religion, no beliefs, no bullshit...where is it?  It is NOT.  I Am NOT.  Yet I am everything.  No separation.  I'm saying things I've read but never believed or "got", but now I don't have to believe, because I fucking (sorry) KNOW.

How did you come up with this "direct way" of guiding people.....why does it sometime take Zen people as well as others YEARS AND YEARS to  get this?  I know why it took me....but what about people who have "given their life" to their "Masters", for what?  For promises of Liberation.....always an arm's length away?  What do you do that is so different.  I've always heard that when you finally "get

it", don't be surprised that - "Nothing changes, but in the way you look at the  world, everything changes."

So how does it feel to be liberated?

Just like that last statement.  My bills are still there, I'm still by myself, I still live where I live, my job is the same.,.....yet, I "see" it all from a completely different view.  Why aren't I feeling the same sadness and self-pity?  I don't get it....it HAS to  be that I've finally realized that there is NO ME to  feel that way.  I feel light and sort of care free.....it may sound strange, but I don't really care or feel "personally connected" to whatever comes.  Whatever comes, comes.  The End.  I don't control life.  Who the hell am I to think that I can control anything that happens?  Are you kidding me?  I don't have and don't want that kind of power.

I think that if I re-read any of the classic texts, like The Tao De Ching, or Ramana Maharshi, I feel that instead of being lost, I could actually "understand" what they were  talking about.  This is life altering.......I have to ask again......will this "stick"......do I need, as you say, "after-care".....I would not want to lose this freedom, maybe I can't.....it's too new, I don't really know......what do you recommend I do?  I would love to help people once I am "stabilized".......How can

you not pay forward what you have "shown"?

Ilona:

Thank you! Your answer is really touching.

What is different in what I do?  I make you look for yourself.  That's

enough to break the wall of believing what somebody else says.  One

look and it's over.

Yes, we have an amazing aftercare group and it REALLY helps to

speak to people who went through the same thing,  because doubt

comes up. It takes time to settle, rebalance the system so it can run

smooth.

Nothing to fear about, nothing to loose.  It's a period of falling...

So for the end of this conversation can you answer these few questions:

Is there a you in any shape or form at all?

What was that last push for you?

What is this 'self' and how does it work?

What would you say to somebody who came to this for first time and

never heard about it.

DC10:

I make you look for yourself.  That's enough to break the wall of

believing what somebody else says.  One look and it's over.

Of course!  Any one truly liberated through the ages have always said things like, "it's closer than your breath", "you already are, but don't know it".....I have to say, and this is only "my" opinion, but having someone there who "knows" to guide you, makes all the difference in the world.  Yes, you have to look for yourself, but having someone "point" out where to look and what look for is the difference.....at least to "me" (not).

On a side note, my depression has lifted. This is a sort of therapy, maybe another facet of what you do?

Is there a you in any shape or form at all?

No, and I see there never was.  And life runs much better and more smoothly without "me" in the way.  I "thought" there was. Now I've "seen" through that illusion.  There's really nothing to add.

What was that last push for you?

Sort of early on, when you asked "is there a witness? or is witnessing happening?", I gave you the answer that I really didn't know, I said something like, "it seems like there is both".

Then you, not letting me off the hook that easily, said, "is it just a thought passing by, I am witnessing... Can I do anything?"  That was when it all really "hit" me and I "knew" I was really getting it, for the first time.  At that point it all seems so obvious, it was almost funny...

Maybe the final push was when I allowed the fear to be there, and  realized that no, there isn't a "me" to allow the fear.....then it got very funny as it was so completely obvious and so simple, obviously simple enough to overlook after a lifetime of seeking.

What is this 'self' and how does it work?

The 'self' is a bundle of conditioning from parents, school, friends, society that tell you 'who' you are, what to believe and very soon on, you do.  When you believe your thoughts, both good and bad, you create the 'self", with all its fears, insecurities, as well as "I’m better than everyone else at....whatever".  This 'self", when believed, runs your life, controls your actions and decisions.....when the truth is, only when you 'let go' of the 'self' are you TRULY in control.  By 'control',

I mean you allow things to happen as they do, you don't try to control anything, then you're not 'controlled".  You don't take life's 'events' personally.

 It wants you to believe it's protecting you by feeding off your fear......and  let's face it, there's enough fear to go around for everyone, if you choose to believe it.  Anything that happens in nature is not personal.....anything that happens in Life is not personal.  Why should it be any different?  Because of "self" and "thoughts".

What would you say to somebody who came to this for first time and

never heard about it.

What I've already told my best friend.  If you're still searching, you need to go to this site, or Marked Eternal first, read the work she is doing there.....go over the Start Here page and answer the questions yourself.  It doesn't cost a thing.  That's a big plus, when you see there is no money 'scam' thing going on.

Give it a chance.  You've got nothing to lose (except you!), which I do not say at first....I just tell them that I've found an inner peace and in this short time I've seen how life can just 'flow', if you get 'you' out of the way and just let it.

I hope I've answered that question in the way you were asking, Ilona....I wasn't really sure.

I feel really good....a little nervous, as I said of "back-sliding".....I want to tell people, but most of my friends would not really understand, I don't believe.

All I can say is thank you very much! Where do 'I' go from here?

Ilona:

This is just perfect!  I’m delighted for you.  I love your clarity.  I’m

feeling lots of appreciation here.

Please join our Facebook group and stick around.  There will be

questions and doubts and all other stuff as part of falling, but you are

through and from now on, life get’s interesting. :)

Thank you for sending your friend here.  It's a real pleasure to assist

in this.  If you get interested in learning some tips on guiding, you are

very welcome to join our team.  It's not magic.

But for now, just rest, let it settle.  Enjoy the ride!!  woo hooo!

 DC10:

 Thank you Ilona! You were great, and please feel free to use our talk on any of your sites!!

Ilona:

Thank you. You are blue now..

DC10:

Thank you....though I certainly don't feel 'blue'!

It Feels Wonderful To See Everything As It Is...

Caroline

Thank you for answering.. Feeling excited like a little girl and a little tired too.. But YES , I want to go all the way through.. Before, I thought I had to get prepared, to know, so that I could succeed at what you would ask me.. Now, I feel that the best is to not know.. So yes, let's go for it.. And I'm willing to be honest..

 Love

Ilona     

Awesome.

So tell as you see now, what is me? What is self? What is I.

Just answer as you see.

Caroline              

'me', 'self', 'I' are thoughts..

 Ilona

What do they point to?

Caroline              

nothing..

Now, it comes too: self, I, me point to nothing as thoughts..

Ilona

Where do thoughts come from?

Can you control them?

Can you stop one in the middle?

Notice how thought I, me, just come and pass like other thoughts.

Can a thought think?

Caroline                              

I can't find where they come from.

No, I can't control them.

No, I can't stop one in the middle.

Yes, yes, yes, 'I', 'me', same as other thoughts..

Oh my.. so much energy through the fingers..

No, a thought can't think..

Ilona

So if I say, that there is no self at all in real life, is it true?

What comes up, check feelings. 

Caroline              

Woke up this morning with intense contraction in the upper chest.. Seemed like self is that.. Then saw that it's just a thought arising about this feeling.. as if the thought is: 'this contraction shoudn't be there..'

When reading you now, I seemed like focused on this sensation, as if yes, there is self and it's located here.. Writing this, there is relief now..

There is no self in real life.. Feelings happen like feeling of contraction in the upper chest.. Thoughts happen too like 'self is the contraction in the upper chest', 'contraction in the upper chest shoudn't be there'... Just thoughts..

I notice sadness now.. Often felt that when focusing on 'no self'... some thoughts arising like 'what am I going to lose'?.. Yes, just thoughts... 'I can't let go of taking myself for these thoughts, contractions'..'What is going to happen?'.. There is labelling about the contraction in the upper chest.. And there is a kind of attachment that it's me..

Let me send you that..

Ilona     

Hi caroline. 

Yes, thoughts feelings just come up and pass.

Notice how well they are connected- thought triggers feeling, feelings gets labeled, again triggers feeling and it's rolling.

But can you look at the feeling itself, notice where it feels, bring it closer and honour it. Say sadness, please come closer. I feel you.  What can you show me?  I respect you and bow to you. 

Then look what is behind sadness. Is there anyone that sadness is happening to or is it just a feeling that came for a visit. 

Let me know what you find. 

Much love.

Caroline                              

Yes Ilona.. :) Heureux Thank you.. Let's carry on..

Thank you so much for what you said about how to address the feeling.. It didn't work straight away... There was contraction, wanting to escape.. The belief in failure was triggered too..  So yes, I noticed how it's rolling like you said..

Then I felt to ask 'sadness' if it likes being sadness.. And it answered no and asked me to liberate it.. From this moment I began to feel profound relaxation.. Felt to say 'I love you' to sadness.. It lost its grip.. It felt like I'm the love the contraction is looking for.. or it could be more accurate to say that love is always here.. Can't find anyone or anything that could be love.. This appeared weird to the mind but I felt to surrender to how the response to the contraction was appearing.. And it was all very subtle.. But couldn't deny the feeling of profound relaxation, warmth, love.. Then, a feeling that appeared stronger than sadness appeared as doubt.. It took more time to lose its grip.. But now it seems that it did.. Other feelings arose again too like failure..

What is behind sadness? - Only thought..

No, sadness happens to no one.. Yes, it just appeared..

Felt to check now what comes if I say: 'There is no self at all in real life..' Yes it's true.. Now there is feeling of joy in the upper chest like wanting to laugh instead of the contraction, sadness, doubt.. I mean feelings still appear but it doesn't happen to someone.. Before it felt like I wanted to get rid of the mind's functioning.. wanted to get rid of labelling, feelings.. Now it seems like it doesn't matter as it doesn't happen to someone.. And in the same time it seems that the contracted parts that are still looking for something are noticed more than before.. And the response as the feeling of the loving presence happens too spontaneously..

So now it seems that stillness is always here somehow whatever arises.. There is nothing to hold on to.. And on the same time even if doubt cannot stay or mean anything, noticing thoughts like 'this cannot be it, this cannot be liberation, it's too simple'.. And the response appears as a subtle laughter, no excitment, nothing special..  I mean I always imagined that I will feel something special.. Like a beautiful story of how 'me', 'I', disappeared.. ~ laughter ~

Seeing that 'I' as reality has never been.. ~ laughter ~ But I was looking for something else than This.. ~ smile ~ What is there now doesn't look like anything I have ever imagined.. There was seeing before that appeared like this but now I see that there was someone in control of the seeing too.. This is incredible.. Feeling like energy is liberated in the shoulders, feeling heat.. Seeing the belief in being Caroline Dacruz as a construct.. nothing real.. omg..  

Let me send you this..You're help is very appreciated.. There can be something hidden I'm not seeing.. ( There is a feeling of tiredness now that may show something too..)

Much love

 Ilona

Wowowow!! I'm delighted for you. 

Yes! This is great.  I love the bit about laughter. Isn't that just ridiculously funny! And you got it rodyt how to deal with feelings. 

I have some questions left for you.

Answer when ready. Rest today, let it settle :)))

Much love!

........................

1) Is there a you, at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?

2) Explain in detail what the self is and how it works.

3) How does it feel to be liberated?

4) how would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about no you.

5) what is real?

...........................     

      

How is your day today, Caroline?

Caroline

Perfect.. ~smile ~ Everything just as it is.. Beautiful sunny day in Paris, in awe with the breeze in my bamboos.. Feeling lazy, still.. :)

Yes let me answer the last questions..

Aah ahaha.. This first question making me laugh again..

It came several time to answer this question in a funny way.. But then the thought came: 'No, answer this in a serious way'..

Can't help.. So here is the answer: - And I say no..no.. no.. nonono.. no..no.. there's no me at all.. aahahaa.. There is no me at all anywhere, in any way, shape or form..

The self is a total construct, belief in a separate entity.. It works with identification with memory, thoughts, sensations.. identification with 'I' thought..

How does it feel to be liberated? - ~ smile ~ This question triggered tension so many times.. It feels wonderful to see everything as it is.. Nothing needs to be different.. It feels like everything is traceless.. It just happens.. fresh.. Thoughts happen, labelling happens and yet it cannot define what is.. Isn't this wonderful?.. Yes, this body-mind mechanism is just amazing.. All these words, labelling, cannot stop.. There is a kind of laziness to answer the questions, first.. and yet, words come, there is joy and I'm amazed by that..

How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about no you?.. -Everything just happens and it happens to no one.. No one is doing anything.. Doing happens.. Thoughts, sensations happen.. But no one is doing all this.. (not sure I would say that to my grandma but who knows.. ~ smile ~)

What is real ? -This moment as it is.. Seeing, typing, feeling..

Well, that's it.. Don't see anything else to say for now..

Thank you

Ilona

BEAUTIFUL

yes the shift happened for sure. now it's a matter of settling in.

wow.

I am amazed that you did it so quick. Thank you.

could I use our conversation for my blog? im sure it will help other people.

and please read this http://markedeternal.blogspot.com/p/start-here.html

It iwll give you an idea what to expect after.

we also have a group that is like an aftercare. everyone in there has seen though the illusion and it really helps, when stuff comes up to talk to others. i'll add you there. just ajust the settings. stay around for a bit. it really helps.

love you!

Caroline              

Tears arising Ilona... They arised yesterday too with immense gratitude for you.. I can't explain this feeling..

Of course you can use our conversation for your blog..

I am amazed too.. Maybe one can say the path has already been cleared enough.. Needed a little push.. And life beautifully guided me to Elena's blog.. Straight away I felt guided to read Ciaran Healy and read demon theory.. Resistance arose and in the same time I knew he was speaking the truth.. And from then I began to feel something within was feeling seriously in danger.. Then read your blog.. Such deep resistance, fear of dying.. feeling of lack, of lacking of liberation, to 'it doesn't matter at all.. I'm fine..' When I read some folks criticizing RT, Ciaran Healy, you and Elena, I can so relate.. I had the same thoughts, same critics.. But something kept showing me that I was lying to myself in resisting.. And yes, humility seemed to be asked.. But now it is seen as nothing.. I knew I couldn't continue to live in lie anymore.. as subtle as it may appear.. In the same time the resistances were arising, their was such wonder about what I felt was going on with what I felt RT, you, Elena were offering.. It reflects so much all the unknown about what is going on on this planet.. I was skeptical about Ciaran Healy, RT, you, Elena.. You know, it's like we hold on so much to the past, to the old ways.. like pretending to know how liberation should look like.. Anyway, I trust that, like I experienced, resistance has its time but one day or another we cannot not answer the call..

Yes, felt touched by reading the 'falling' part today.. And I am so grateful that you and the other friends are here to support.. I have found this nowhere else.. This is so precious.. And all this without asking for money.. Hmmm.. Heart filled with deep gratitude..

I am already in a group where I wasn't supposed to be.. lol.. But anyway it helped to be in this group before seeing through the illusion.. Seeing that it works and being inspired by others honesty did help for sure.. I saw your post about another group too today.. Wonderful.. Feel inspired to help too.. Even before seeing through the illusion it was there.. But it was obvious that I couldn't help in seeing what I didn't see myself.. I trust life to guide me perfectly here.. Feel the need for things to settle more too..

I love you too my beautiful friend.. How grateful I am for trusting you.. Like you say, things get interesting in 'Falling'.. Let's see what comes..

Ilona

Thank you.

Lots of appreciation here.  Lots of love.

I have been so busy with organising our new playground at LU and it's gonna be grand. When it settles you are welcome to join in to help others.

For now rest, Caroline. Its like being reborn and none of the old makes sense anymore, and new is not settled yet. Just trust in the process and if anything ever arises that you want to talk to me, I'm here for you. 

Much love. 

Freedom Comes When Your Realise That There Is Nothing You Can Control

Amy:
I really like what you say on the Awaken Now page. It coincides with what I have been taught by my therapist who is an awakening teacher. His way can be fairly dark at times because you go into the depths of your Fear and release old emotional pain. Truth and clarity comes when you look at it for yourself. My awakening was very dark. I think I had multiple "dark night of the soul" moments in the 7 weeks I suffered with the old emotionally energy.

I try to seek answers from people who have been there. I like Clinton, but his advice goes against what I feel I have to do to be free. I feel the pull to go through these emotions and old beliefs. To just ignore them because they are the ego sounds easy, but impossible to do.

So if you don't mind, I have a question. I think I found my core belief that holds me back from being truly awake. I view the world as unpredictable and unsafe. I lived in an emotionally unpredictable family (my older sister was crazy!) with an anxious mother. I was taught happiness and safety comes when there was peace in the house. I married a military man and that is as unpredictable as it comes! LOL So I learned over the years that you had to try and control the environment, to make it predictable in order to feel some safety. Now I realize you can't be present and still brace for unpredictable events. I *know* happiness is within me and not at the hands of other people, but there is this smokescreen of a belief that separates me from that.

How do you go about dissolving that belief and actually allowing yourself to live without a safety net and KNOW you are still safe?

Thank you for any advice you can give.

Ilona:
Hi Ami.
Thank you very much for writing to me.
Yes, I can help you to pass the fear.
But, the core belief that is in every human head is that we are separate entities. When in reality there is only one life happening by itself.
We'll get to that too. After seeing it clearly, everything stays the same, but everything inside changes. The sticky point is gone. There is freedom in every situation.

Next time fear cones up, just look at it. Let it be there. Just observe it and notice that it's protection mechanism. Write to me what you see.

Much love.

Thank you so much for your help. I have two modes to my awakening. One is energy with perspective (that is the easy one) and the other is energy attached with emotion. I call it being snowed in because you lose your perspective and you feel lost in these beliefs and limitations. I tend to reach out to people when I get the snowed in feeling because I don't do well with feeling helpless.

This fear went to a whole other level when I got sick last year. It was a mystery illness for 4 months before a diagnosis was made. Lots of tests and procedures that came back normal until they discovered it was gallbladder. Having your own health become unpredictable was the last straw. When you can't even trust yourself to be safe brought me to my crossroads and my awakening.

I don't want to live in fear of the future or myself anymore. Next time it happens, I will look at it. I am actually quite good at that. I will let you know what I see.

Thank you again. I am very appreciative of having a woman on my side. Men make everything sound too easy. LOL

You don't need to wait for the big fear, just do it next time small fear arises. Small frustration is easy to deal with. And the once you catch it, bring it closer.

Also, have you tried EFT? If not look up on you tube. It really helps to release feelings. Works very well and is very simple.

Write soon.


I feel it as blocked energy residing in my solar plexus. It is nervous energy, buzzing almost. If I watch it long enough sometimes it dissolves and sometimes it moves to another area in my stomach. My digestive system will pick up on it and it make crazy sounds and goes through my digestive system. If I am lucky, I will become awakened for a few hours. It is clear, beautiful and full of gratitude. But it doesn't last long and the energy in the same place returns and I start all over again. You start to question if there isn't something wrong with you.

There is nothing wrong with you.

I have learned to be careful who you reach out to. I was on vacation and there was an energy healer and psychic having a demonstration. I was looking at her Chakra charts and the heart chakra drew my attention. I told her I was going through an awakening and this is where the energy congregated. She looked at me doubtful and then filled me in that menopausal symptoms happen before actual menopause (I am only 43). She was telling me the energy wasn't from an awakening and I was suffering bad with it during that time. I almost lost it. Then you have people with good intentions like Clinton, that tells you to just stop the search and just "be". Well, if I could do that, don't you think I would have by now? Then you read books about people who look at their fears and "allow and accept" and then it disappears magically. I allow and accept for hours and hours. Thankfully, it is much easier on me now than it was a 1.5 months ago. I am not afraid of the energy. I am just tired of it and wondering when it will lose its grip on me and when the ego will let go of me. If nothing else, I know for myself, that the only what out of it is through. I can actually feel the energy on a cellular level. Sometimes it even wakes me out of a sound sleep when I am going through one of my "snowed in" waves. I believe I am awareness. I have seen it. But my ego is rather strong and stubborn and is trying to exact power back. So you go back into disillusionment.

Thank you for your willingness to walk me through this. From your perspective, should I be doing anything differently or is it just a matter of time?

l
Read this.

http://markedeternal.blogspot.com/2011/08/releasing-of-sufferer.html

Write what you feel about this conversation.
Much love.

Wow!! There is a lot here that needs absorbing. I was met with doubt and resistance when you mentioned there was no real Self. I just couldn't wrap my head around it. I have had moments of awareness, but I guess I likened it to my body's thoughts and sensations being at peace for the time being. There is no fear or conflicting thoughts at play.

Thoughts and feelings not being permanent and always in transition is something I have become comfortable about. The labelling machine of the brain is something I understand. Being nothing more than a tree or rock is a concept I have heard, but my body is resistant towards. I think that is why I am so sensitive to the feeling of suffering. I haven't crossed that line yet. I still take it personally.

What gave me great comfort was that she sincerely wished to die. I have felt that way 3 different times. The first time was frightening, but I had the biggest amount of clarity afterwards. As much as I didn't like the two other times, I knew that clarity would follow, so I didn't get caught up in the feelings at the moment. I also couldn't eat for days because of the energy in my stomach. The only thing I could do was release on the sofa for hours, days and weeks. So I am grateful there are others out there like that.

I am going to re-read this again later tonight when the family is settled for the night.

I agree my fear is protecting something. It clenches around the area where the energy is. I always thought it was protecting my vulnerability, but I am really going to look much deeper next time.

Separating my Self from the story of my life and not being affected by the scenes that play out will be my biggest feat!

Thank you for this very important fork in my journey. It isn't something I have been approached with before.

I will write more as thoughts come!

..............................
Hello! I am still absorbing! I am less resistance and more open to the possibilities of the things said. Much of my teachings and the books I have read have been around Buddhism. They don't delve into the mechanics of the ego as much as just letting go to what arises in you.

What started my process was the intensity of the energy that showed u one day. I could feel myself getting more and more stressed as my mystery illness dragged on and I was in pain. That is when my doctor thought it was anxiety. I never had anxiety before and it was a huge shock because I couldn't escape it. I knew enough about sitting with it with my therapist, but was shocked that it just didn't go away. There was no end. It actually intensified at times. Then I became extremely concerned and went on meds. They really never helped. Something big was going on and I had to figure out what it was. So off the meds I went and started looking at this darkness again. The energy didn't show up again until 3 months off the meds (this late June) and it came back with a vengeance. My therapist told me it was repressed emotional pain. Do you buy into Tolle's explanation of the Pain Body? That was the only thing that saved me during those times. Mine is huge and I feel it is still coming out in a consistent stream, although less severe. So sometimes there is a blurry line between fear and emotional pain? I just know that I can get really tired and sad with constantly having to deal with it. So if I am the watcher, how does the watcher not feel or get involved with what arises because you can't escape your body?

I woke up with energy today. I looked at it and behind it. An image came to mind that I have seen before a few years back. There was a little spirit that was meant to soar. Her wings got clipped and got very sick because of this. I have protected her ever since.

Thank you for writing this. I see that process has started and I'll help you through all the way.

Can you look at feeling itself. Anything that you are feeling now. Close your eyes, find it. Notice, is it personal? Can you look what is behind the feeling, is there a feeler?

Find the sense of aliveness, being, that which is always here now. Look at that sense, is it personal? What is behind that feeling?

Notice that there is always narration going on. Thoughts labelling what is being felt, sensed, experienced. One of them labels is me. Notice that. It's a label. Is there an actual entity that is behind 'me'?

Write what you've got

Much love


Deep stuff...just what I like.  I have a ton of family obligations to do today. It is one of the pitfalls of being a Mother and wife. LOL Tomorrow things will be much quieter and I will do what you ask.

Thank you so much for wanting and being willing to see me through this. It can be quite isolating at times. My family doesn't understand and quite frankly it scares my husband, so I have been doing it on my own and hiding it.

ok, I did some of the work while I was taking a "nap". I asked myself if I knew there was no "me". It was tolerant for a little bit and then a huge wave came in. I was able to watch it rise in conflict, stabbing sensations in my chest and the feeling of rising and falling (like if you were on a very fast moving rollercoaster). I could see my narration like I was calling out a ballgame play. There was a feeling of loss looming. I can't say I reconciled it because I had to get up again. When a wave hits, I usually get hard until it finally burns through. I don't think I am going to resolve this today. I think it will put up quick a stink. People have warned me to let the process come to me and not look to provoke it. Do you think I am doing that? I also don't want to be one of those people who somehow learn to bypass important steps in the process and jump to the finish line. I want to be Phoenix Rising, with nothing else to question and nothing else to fear.

 

It is really happening all by itself. No matter what you believe about it at the moment, the ride is on. There is no one driving.
Take small steps. First thing first- need to clear the path. That is done by accepting the fear. It's ok to be afraid. Completely. Just let that fear rise and pass. It's a feeling that has been blocked and wants to leave. Ask your body if it's ready to let the fear leave. Listen to the answer. If not yet don't worry, we will work through that. If yes, then great!

Imagine the feelings are visitors. When they come for a visit, you can tell them to go away or you can bring them in and get to know your guests. Learn from them, respect them.
Look behind fear. What is there? What is it trying to protect?

Much love.


Your second paragraph immediately reminded of one of my favorite poems by Rumi:

"The Guest House"
This being human is a guest house.
Every morning a new arrival.

A joy, a depression, a meanness,
some momentary awareness comes
as an unexpected visitor.

Welcome and entertain them all!
Even if they’re a crowd of sorrows,
who violently sweep your house
empty of its furniture,
still, treat each guest honourably.
He may be clearing you out
for some new delight.

The dark thought, the shame, the malice,
meet them at the door laughing,
and invite them in.

Be grateful for whoever comes,
because each has been sent
as a guide from beyond


I joke about this poem because I invite everyone in and am a wonderful host letting them do as much damage as they want. I smile and give free reign. BUT, after the 2nd day or 8th hour, you start to look at your clock and wonder when in the heck are they going to leave? LOL

I don't think I am afraid of the sensation of fear anymore. It is more of the wearing down of not being able to meditate to release it. So you feel it in your solar plexus all day and you are aware of it every second. That is when I get tired because it turns into a secondary obsession of being constantly aware of it. Then you start to feel bad for yourself that there is just no break from it. You can't enjoy the presence until it is cleared. Or like this past time, I was rudely taken out of my peaceful state by a hijack thought that took me by surprise by its reaction.

You have recharged my batteries on this journey. I am not dreading the process again. I go through these phases where I see the path in front of me is clear in what I need to do.

So you think this is more fear than an monster size well of old emotional pain?

 

Yes, it's a monster size emotional thing. Did you look up emotional freedom technique? EFT? Have a look on you tube. There are some points that you lightly tap and energy is released. I would really recommend it for you. It's so simple, but it works very well.
Let's just work a little bit more here with your feelings.

Did you have a look what is behind fear?


Truth, Reality and current Assessment

I think I may have heightened or merged many of my feelings and symptoms because I am still a bit traumatized from everything I have been through thus far. I truly appreciate your help, and I want to do everything I can to break through my barriers. The only way I think you can truly help me is if I take my past feelings and thoughts away from my current status. So here are some truths i believe about myself  :

1. I have a pain body. It is pure energy that starts as a ball in my solar plexus. It takes me about an hour now a days to be able to relax and get inside of this ball in order to start releasing it. I don't find a lot of intelligence or emotions in this state. But I have it through out the day off and on. It can become tiring.

2. I will sometimes get hit with the feeling of a roadblock or belief that will ooze into my consciousness. The alarm of fear is the first thing I sense. This is where I can do inquiry. Underneath the fear is usually helplessness and sadness. Sometimes it is sadness and love. Inquiry usually brings on a deeper layer of processing. Those are the ones that can last a few to several days and you start to feel lost.

3. I think underneath it all...I don't think I have a fear of death as much as I have a fear of not being free and living. I have been searching for it all my life. I feel it calling me home, but I am always lost or facing roadblocks. Before all this happened, I used to care about protecting my family. I wanted them to live and be safe. I never cared about myself until I got sick. I realized I wasn't the armored truck I thought I was. My body was a silent partner all my life. Now it is screaming at the top of its lungs with sensations and emotions. Quite a stark contrast and something I am getting used to.

4. I actually prefer to process and meditate because I believe I am doing something that will help me. If I am not meditating, then my brain is constantly analyzing trying to make sense of everything. I have always been an analyzer. It is hard to turn off and you don't live in the present much. So basically, I am not living no matter what I do.

I am going to meditate again right now and see what is there. I am not afraid of going into dark places as long as it takes me a step closer to freedom.


oh and about the EFT. I did look it up. It doesn't seem to have effect when the energy is a ball and I am up and around. I did use it during meditation today after I was able to open the ball. It made it smooth and flat. I wasn't if it was gone or just took a sleeker form. I will use it again when it happens.


Play with EFT. It does work. Do it for a couple of days to take the edge of feelings and we'll be able to carry on smoothly.
Much love!


Thank you! I looked for another video online and used that one with more success. It took it away for a few minutes and then it felt like it opened a portal and tears came out. I wasn't frightened or sad, but more cleansing. I will work on it for the next few days and get back to you.

One last question. When all is said and done, do the emotions and sensations all go away? Or is it more that they still come and go and you just don't react to them the same anymore?

No, emotions don't go away, but emotional pain goes. No more reactions. They all accepted equally and released quickly.


Sounds wonderful. I'll be in touch.

...............................
Either I will be more most favourite student or the most trying....but I want to proceed. I spent most of the day meditating and clearing what was there I have no problem bringing my feelings close to me, but it is a hit or miss if I can show them compassion. Today I was able to do that and give myself space.

Maybe because I can sense it is nearer to me than I thought, but I REALLY want to dissolve the ego at its core. I want the beliefs, pain and thoughts to melt completely away. Tell me what to do next. I am completely ready to go as deep as you need me too.


Great. Let's start.
Fist lay down all your expectations. What do you imagine liberation is gonna do for you. Full honesty, please.


free from being trapped into playing the ego's game.

List at least 10, really look into it.


I would feel a deep resounding feeling of peace

I would feel joy and relaxed

Gratitude!

I won't be afraid of myself anymore from the dark thoughts and reactions I can conjure on a whim.

Acceptance of life as it is.

Won't be afraid of the future for myself or family

Be able to see clearly and live in the present moment much more readily.

Welcome all feelings and emotions with compassion

Trust that all is what is supposed to be.

I would have a knowing that I can handle anything that comes my way, so I wouldn't have to feel like I need to brace for something bad that could happen.


Great. Now when you written them all out I'd like you to let them rest here for a while and not worry about how it's gonna be. You are gonna look for yourself. So just let them stay here and move on.

Next task is to imagine, how would everything run, if there were no you/ self/ I at all in real life. Just let your imagination create a story here and express it in detail.

What would life be like without separate selves. Write all that comes up, including feelings.


This is more of a loaded question and where my core conflict comes from.

I have had moments of the awakened side of me to see the Truth. I wake up excited to start a new day. The whole day flows like a whimsy summer day. Nothing is taken to heart and I am interested and content in everything I am doing-even housework. I can see through people's pain and realize not to take it personally. My presence and love for them would help smooth their rough spots. They would feel more happy and at ease in life because I project that in myself. I would be able to touch many people and have great insight and compassion for them. I can go for a walk with my dogs and see the magic and majesty of nature. I am overwhelmed with joy over the simpliest leaf hanging on the tree and how it dances in the breeze. I can sit in stillness or boredom and not scramble for something to fill the void. I am love.

The ego side of me says the world is unsafe and unpredictable. Who will protect you if you destroy me? I have kept you safe all these years and have loved and accepted you when you thought no one else did. I created you to be strong so you wouldn't feel rejected every again. If you think you can get rid of me, you will have to work harder and suffer more than you can imagine. You are nothing without me and you will have to earn your right to be happy. I will bring you to the fires of hell and make you feel every flame before you think I can be beaten. Remember that anxiety I gave you? That is proof of your weakness and a fatal flaw to always remind you that you can never be truly free from me.

ok, let's examine ego. is there ego in real life? or is it a fictional character? what does word ego point to? something real or some thoughts about ego?


Ego is not real, ego are thoughts. Ego, for some reason, can feel real when you buy into those thoughts.


I thought about this and now refining my answer. Ego is a collection of thoughts and sensations in the body. How your body reacts to a certain thought forms a belief. Many thoughts are outdated and useless in the here and now, but your body still reacts to them as if they are real, so you feel like a prisoner within those parameters.


Let's look at thought itself. Where does it come from? What controls thoughts?
Can you stop a thought in the middle? Do you know what the next thought will be?
What influences thoughts?
Notice how thought appears and fingers type.
What do you see?

Certain thoughts are completely random. Almost like watching a movie. Other times it seems to have intelligence like writing you. Although I don't know what I am typing next, the words and images I wish to project are more organized in order to send you this email. So is there a higher intelligence at play somewhere? Is the mind organizing the thoughts and putting it together cohesively?

I have a scenario that plays out almost every morning and am not sure you want to go off subject yet. If you don't, I totally understand and we will follow our line of conversation to its end before we move on. When I wake up first thing in the morning, I have a hijack thought as soon as I wake from dream state. It is truly just a flicker of a thought. It asks if I have energy this morning. I might not even wake up with energy, but this thought instantly produces the emotion of dread and fear. It triggers the sensation in the body as the form of energy in my solar plexus. This is all instantaneous. Then you wake up and feel bad about the start of your morning and that I will have to meditate to try and release that energy. I mean I know it was just a thought, but the body is so trigger happy to respond to it and once it is in my body, it doesn't just disappear. I have to release it through meditation. So this is either my process letting me know I have more emotional pain to release today or I am stuck in a hair trigger pattern that may have created my pain body over the years.



I hope I am not bothering you with my multiple emails, I am processing faster than you able to get back to me. That seems to be my whole day. Analyze and process. I think I get frustrated at times because I forget there is a beautiful life to live and enjoy.


I reread the blog about you and D this morning. It is funny how somethings now make sense and then you pick up on other parts of the conversation as if you were reading it for the first time.

I definitely feel the belief in the ego has all the ability in the world to fall away. What keeps ego active is the strength of the thoughts and or feelings that are still surfacing. Back when feelings and energy were really strong, I was able to allow and accept based on the fact that I realized it was the pain body and it would eventually end. Ego stayed in the background. After the initial horrid wave was over, I thought I "made" it. But something was still off. I still felt I wasn't there yet. Two weeks later, I made an inquiry and that triggered another wave. I was surprised and disappointed that although not as uncomfortable as the first time, that I still had more to release. Got through that, was awakened for several hours and then off and on for days then that hijack thought I wrote about on Awaken Now about how unsafe and unpredictable life is. That started yet ANOTHER wave. Once again, not as severe as either of the other two, but now I am losing my patience and am getting frustrated that I am not farther along. I started to take it personally and that is when I felt trapped and ego becomes alive, accept I realize I have no control over what is popping in my psyche. That is when I reached out to you. To once and for all find an end to this cycle. It is like the never ending story. This well of emotions keep finding blowholes in the body. They can still be rather strong and uncomfortable at times and catch me by surprise. Just like the trigger thoughts I have been having. The bottom line is that I may have accepted them as a necessary discomfort of the process, but I haven't accepted them with total compassion and love. I can sometimes find it in meditation, but not in normal day to day activities. It is hard to feel love for a feeling like dread or helplessness when you are sitting at the dinner table trying to talk to your family. Where does one get love and compassion for feelings they find distasteful? LOL


I feel that is causing my suffering. The ego is just a reflection of my feelings and thoughts about that suffering. I just want to get to that place of peace where the thought and the emotion becomes naturally and flows freely without it sticking in the body. Does that make sense or am I off track?


You are doing very well Amy.
Now let's try one thing, ok.

There is no separate self at all in real life. As in zero, is it true?

Tell me what comes up.
Including feelings.

True. There is no separate self. Just thoughts and feelings that you have internalized and became to know as "I". I am the Spirit who came to this world as if to buy tickets to the theatre. Somewhere it became lost and started to believe and act as if it were the main character of the movie. I truly believe that. I get frustrated and sad when I can't always stay in that mind frame. Feelings, thoughts and sensations drag me back into thinking it is personal, that *I* am being attacked and that there is something wrong because there seems to be no end to the cycle. I get dragged back into disillusionment, knowing it isn't real, but feeling trapped by the power of those thoughts, feelings and sensations.


Let's talk about spirit. Is there a separate spirit for each human? Is there one spirit? Does that spirit splits in separate spirits? How does that work?


I have been taught and have come to believe that there is only one source-all reflections of God or Eternal Self. We are all divine aspects /expression of that one source.


What is god in regards to life?


hmm...it get stickier here because it has changed many times in the past few months. LOL God is the collective nature of our divinities or expressions. I see God most readily in nature. It is perfect working balance and order.


Is god= life?


Life/or Nature is a reflection of God. It is the most realistic way for us to experience it here with our limitations in our bodies. I feel God is so much more, but can't be experienced until we join the collective.


God= life= reality= 1
Self, me, I = zero.

Once it's seen, then everything falls into place.

Ok, let's carry on.
Can you see that thoughts and feelings are connected. Thought triggers feeling, feeling gets labelled by thought and it's a circle. Is there a 'me' in the process or all is happening on automatic?


From your mouth, straight to the core of my psyche. at least I hope!

Thoughts trigger feelings for sure. Instantly automatic. Sometimes sensations come first and then thoughts get triggered trying to make sense of what the sensations are. All automatic also. There is no me controlling it at all. Then why are the feelings and thoughts so strong and uncomfortable? All a vicious cycle.

Because there is a confusion in the mind. It thinks that there is a 'me'. But there isn't. Is there a thinker? Check.

How do we unconfuse the mind?


Simple. We look at the thought I. Is there anything behind I that Is thinking?
Notice breathing. We say I breath. Is there a breather or breathing just happens as body function!
Walking. We say I walk. Is there an I that is walking?
Eating. I eat. Is there an eater?
Sorry, but is there a peer? A laughter? A scatter?
Just play with labels for a bit and notice, that nothing requires a doer, all is happening by itself. And I is just another thought that precedes thoughts because of the structure of language.
I type, or typing happens?
I notice or noticing happens?
I see or seeing happens?

Write what you've got.


First thing that I notice is resistance and conflict. Although we have gone through that there is no self in real life, I feel the need to argue that *I* is a word to describle our reflective Spirit in this world. Doesn't spirit have the higher intelligence? Does it only watch? Does it not guide my need to reach out to you and find answers, therefore allowing me the ability to type and communicate with you? I must be getting in muddier waters of my understanding. LOL


There is no spirit, Amy. It's all just life. Life happening as trees, sky, animals, humans. All one life-force that moves everything in synchronicity.

If you can, get outside, take a walk. Watch totality. Notice how everything wiggles, moves together. Notice that the body is not separate from totality. It breathes by itself, it reacts to environment.
Write when you come back. Or at least open a window and stare at reality.

Good advice. I can see my portal is getting smaller and my understanding getting shakier. I will get back to you.


It's good place to know nothing. Then you can look and see what's really there.

Well synchronicity has stepped in to show me the truth. I was outside and totally understood nature. I was having a hard time reconciling humans being a part of that natural balance. Then I picked up a book from one of my teachers that he wrote. The very chapter dealt with the ego and the body. I understand now. I can honestly say now the body is happening. Thoughts are happening. Feelings are happening. There is no me or I having this happen too.

I have to admit, there is a shakiness in me. This is going past my comfort zone and I totally understand this is part of the deconstruction. I am more than willing to proceed to the next question.


Great! You are close!
Seeing is happening. Is there a seer?
Experience is happening. Is there an experiencer?

Experience is happening through synchronicity. All supported by nature or life.

Am I Free now??!!  Will thoughts, feelings and sensations automatically start to have less meaning?


Are you free? How does it feel?


I feel cautiously optimistic! I am curious as to how I will wake tomorrow morning. What/if that thought/feeling trigger will happen and how the body will respond. I will keep you posted.

Thank you so much for seeing me through this. It was hairy there for a second. My mind was thoroughly confused and it has always had a flair for what it thought was right/wrong. It didn't like being boxed into a corner without an answer.

You are the third teacher to cross my path. My therapist introduced me to awareness and letting go. He worked with me through the scary parts of energy. He had the same type of awakening. Then I met an energy healer/shaman out of Mexico. He introduced me to the divinity and synchronicity of life and nature. That is how I met Clinton. I thought he was my next teacher, but now believe he was the path in order to meet you. Your words meshed with all that I have been taught so far and it felt instinctual to reach out to you. You taught me that final piece of the puzzle-deconstructing the ego to set me free from the suffering. I am forever grateful for your work and your generosity towards me.

Now that I have lit all these accolades to all my teachers, watch me burn in a flame of glory.


Awesome, Amy. Thank you.
Let it settle for now, we will talk tomorrow. I'll make sure that you did go all the way through.

About thought/ feelings. They will come up. There are still lots of them stored in the system, but you will notice, that it will be much easier to deal with. And it takes time to clear the house.
But. Once truth is seen, can not be unseen.

Rest now.
Much love!

.............................................
Hi Amy, how is it going today ?


Hi! Yesterday was awesome. I don't think I had one thought. Everything was frozen. Nothing to dread or I didn't care enough to dread because I was mentally spent.

Today started out great. I woke up, thought the thought and didn't own it. It floated by. I decided to do silent meditation although a part of me was scared I would open Pandora’s box and get snagged somewhere. I did fine until I took a shower and the feeling of wanting to cry came over me. I just kept saying "crying happens" and that I don't have any control. Got over that within a few minutes and I have been dealing with nervous type energy for the past hour. I am sure it is my pain body, but it hasn't taken me hostage. I have been using the EFT to varying success. Is there such a thing as giving too much awareness? I don't want to be accused of avoiding my sensations and feelings, so I am always aware of the sensations in my body.

I definitely feel something shifted. Once you see the truth, can you get swept under again? Will I go backwards at all?

Awesome. Truly delighted for you.

It's a bit like Santa situation, once a kid realises that Santa is not real, he can never believe that he is again. So once the truth is seen, it can not be unseen.
There will be still things coming up and situations that will need to be dealt with, but more and more you'll see that there is no sticky point inside.


To finish our conversation I’ll ask you a few questions. Answer in full when ready.

1) Is there a you, at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?

2) Explain in detail what the self is and how it works.

3) How does it feel to be liberated?

4) how would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about no you.

Much love!


I am in the middle of an uncomfortable cycle. Lots to thinking, tears and analyzing. repeat over and over. LOL I don't know how that will show in my answers. It is all so random!


1) Is there a you, at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form?
There is no me.

2) Explain in detail what the self is and how it works.
Self is a collection of thoughts and feelings about what we have sensed through life and label them. This collection makes up the "I". Thinking, feeling, being are all happening without a doer.

3) How does it feel to be liberated?
There has been an abundance of thinking today. I can see how it effects the energy in my body. It heightens it. I have no control over my thinking or reactions. They are happening on their own. Emotions are happening on their own. I am liberated over feeling that there is nothing I am doing to cause all this. I will feel REALLY liberated when the thinking, pain, energy and emotions are much more fluid and less sticky.

4) how would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about no you.

Great question! That suffering can end if you just realize that everything that goes on in your body is happening without a "you". The body is happening without a captain. Thoughts are happening a million a minute and no thinker. Nothing is permanent. Freedom comes when you realize there is nothing you can control.


BEAUTIFUL
yes the shift happened for sure. now it's a matter of settling in.
wow.

i am amazed that you did it so quick. Thank you.
could i use our conversation for my blog? I’m sure it will help other people.
and please read this http://markedeternal.blogspot.com/p/start-here.html
it will give you an idea what to expect after.

we also have a group that is like an aftercare. everyone in there has seen though the illusion and it really helps, when stuff comes up to talk to others. I’ll add you there. just adjust the settings. stay around for a bit. it really helps.


I was just going to ask you if there is aftercare! LOL Of course you can add our conversation to your blog. I wouldn't be here without other people's journey out of it and if I can get through to a stubborn person, like myself, that would be a gift! LO

One last question about this Process or Pain Body...whatever we call it. Tolle wrote this about the pain and thinking and wanted your insight on it:

So Level One: the pain body feeds on your thinking.
Level Two: The pain body feeds on the feed back of the emotional pain from other people


So it might not only use your own thinking it might even predominately use somebody else’s reactions

So the Pain Body feeds on thinking. The Pain Body feeding on others reactions. Now I mentioned last night the “unhappy me” a mind pattern that people are identified with an unhappy sense of self. This mind pattern, when the pain is active it becomes amplified, the Energy of the Unhappy me when the Pain Body moves into that mind pattern that already is telling you “your life has not been good enough” and so on and you may not make it, “life has passed me by”, and so on.

Now the Pain Body moves into that mind pattern and its Energy gets amplified, 10 times, 20 times, 50 times, 100 times in other words the “unhappy me”; the Pain Body arises, it flows into that mind structure, the emotion flows into that mind structure, the Unhappy sense of me becomes dreadfully Unhappy and Loves it’s Unhappiness because that’s what it consists of.


So when I feel the energy going, is it in my best interest to try and contain it by keeping the mind still and meditating on the energy only? Today, it didn't seem I like I had a lot of choice. I haven't cried like that in awhile. The mind and reactions were going so fast that it was frenzy like until I cried to release it. I feel lighter now, but am more afraid that I just ended up feeding the beast vs. releasing old pain. Thoughts?

I love you too.


you can always use some EFT, it's a very good tool. and as for painbody, it's the feedback loop. thought- feeling- more labelling- more feeling. there is no entity such as pain body. it's just a label that Tolle uses for the feedback loop.
it will all clear out as the feelings get released. best technique that I found is looking what is behind the feeling. it dissolves it instantly.
cool, I’ll add you to the group :))


ok, feedback loop is much more understandable! I thought it was just something I had to feel and there would be an end to it. I didn't want to take any shortcuts and thought I had to feel them through until lightness. It's a hard loop to crack! This is the EFT program I have been using. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6i33V2EcVlY

Emotional Freedom Technique (EFT) Introduction
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Visit http://www.Tapping.com/ for more Emotional Freedom Technique videos, EFT articles, and my E-Book. Emotional Freedom Technique (EFT) is a simple accupress...
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It has a hole in it now. The feedback mechanism has been disrupted, after clearing up time which is a bit like hangover, all gonna start feel smooth and more and more effortless. Feelings don't go away, but there is freedom in experience without stickiness.

Just write to me any time you feel. I will help with all I've got.

Love you!