Action Figure Ron Sees IT Too

Ron:

Dear Ilona,

My name is Ron from the Netherlands and I’ve been seeking for liberation from the moment I heard about it a couple of years ago. Read a lot of books and visit satsangs. But I’ve not found the clarity yet I’ve been looking for. Until I read your book ‘Gateless Gatechrashers’. I also heard a radio interview with you and your no nonsense approach moved me. I spend the last 3 months thinking if I should write you or not, because it feels a bit strange to write to someone you don’t know. But there’s something saying inside me I can trust you. So here I’m writing this e-mail and I hope you can guide me if you can find the time. This is what I found so far while answering your questions and pointers:

There is no self, no me that lives my life. What comes up?

 Well, a lot of things come up. Sometimes there’s fear. There’s also excitement. And the last two weeks it’s more like a relief, but also a lot of frustration, irritation and anger because I don’t seem to see it. I know that there’s no me to see it (but that is second hand knowledge). The I seems to be quite strong and convincing.

If try to look behind those feelings, they vanish but come back more strongly and that’s the moment doubt sets in: can this be true? Followed by: call off this search and have a drink with friends.

Overall there is a feeling of doing something wrong, like not looking in the right direction. And some kind of I don’t deserve this feeling. On the other hand, there is some deep urge to know, something that overrides the rest. Sometimes it’s weak, sometimes strong.

What do you expect from liberation?

 I could give myself the ‘spiritual right answer’ but deep down I expect a lot of it.

The moment itself: a deep insight with all revealing light

Afterwards:

No more problems, they glide of like a fried egg in a Teflon pan

Deep peace

No more pain, worries and suffering

Always happy

Being profound and wise in every situation

Deep insight in life

Deep relaxation (my body always feels very tense and dense)

In short: I’m hoping to be special. I know it’s quite the opposite, but again that’s second hand knowledge (and now I’m thinking about it I even borrowed that second hand knowledge quote, everything I say about liberation seems something I picked up somewhere from others). 

What is real? What is here now?

 There is a body sitting on a couch in a room. There is typing. A laptop. There is furniture. There are sounds from outside of people passing by. There are bodily sensations like sitting, some tension in the stomach, which feels like I’m present. There is a lot of thinking about this e-mail. And it is all very, very real.

But when I look for the self all I find are thoughts and bodily sensations (mostly tension). There is no constant I or self so to speak. The one moment I is bodily sensation like a pain, itch, relaxation in the stomach area, etc. Another moment I is a thought like I’m happy, sad or I got to do the dishes. And another moment I is an action like cycling, typing, eating, smoking etc.

I can’t find a solid I, I is constantly shifting from the one thing to another. Strangely there seems to be some kind of center though.

Where do thoughts come from?

They just pop up. Sometimes a thought seems to come from a previous thought. Sometimes a thought seems to be evoked by circumstances or feelings.

Can you control thoughts?

No, I can’t control thoughts. Even I’m gonna think about… is a thought I did not choose for. So they just happen.

I also noticed that some thoughts seem to label things: a chair, a table, good, bad, etc. While others are more like assignments or very pushy ideas at least: do this or…, buy these clothes and you look good, you need a cigarette, etc.

In other words, some thoughts seem to be functional for the body (drink or eat something, it’s cold put the heater on) and other (most) thoughts are about desires, fears and hopes (a kind of destructive). And they all are about me, myself or I, very egoistic.

What influences thought?

Experience.  A sad feeling comes up followed by the thought I’m feeling sad. Then all kind of other thoughts come up like I don’t want to be sad > Why I’m sad?> Oh of course it’s because of what happened this morning (or what might happen this evening)>this gonna be a shitty day. And then it just rambles on in the hope to find a some kind of solution or relief until something else happens (seeing a nice house or something) that breaks the thought cycle and start a new cycle (wouldn’t it be nice if I could buy that house > but I can’t afford it > Maybe, I have to find a job that pays better> etc.) It just never stops.

Do you know what your next thought will be?

No, only vaguely when it is habitual thought cycle you’ve seen a 1000 times before. And even when it’s a ‘here we go again’ thought cycle, it’s not completely predictable and interrupted by all kinds of other thoughts which are completely off subject.

Can a thought be stopped in the middle?

No, thoughts seem to be extremely short like flashes with no beginning, middle or end. They also seem to have some force behind them that can’t be stopped; it’s like trying to stop your hair to grow. Maybe functioning is a better word (but why are most thoughts so depressing than?)

What do you know for sure?

Difficult one, the only thing I’m sure off is what is happening now, sitting, typing, breathing, etc. And a vague sense of being/presence. But deep down I’m not sure of anything at all. I guess there is a lot of doubt.

There is no separate self in real life.

That is not seen yet. Intellectual I get it. But I’ve the feeling I’m missing something. There is no click as you call it.

What I do notice is that everything happens. Seasons change by themselves, weather changes. Everything is alive just by itself. But I feel excluded, like I’m the one exception. Of course I feel alive, but I feel a bit cut off the rest of life. Like I’m inside, and the rest of life is outside. It is like what happens in my head, thought cycles, is more important than what’s really happening. I feel like a kid that wants to play outside but the I keeps me in like a evil stepmom inside the house to do the dishes. This sounds silly doesn’t it, a non-existing me that is forced by a non-existing I to stay inside.

Ilona this where I’m now, and I really hope you can help me on this matter. I would really appreciate it if you would.

Kind regards, 

Ilona:

Hi Ron,

Nice work. I appreciate you wrote to me. Your very honest desire for truth and burning shows readiness. Take that one step further.  There is no line between inside and outside. All you see is it. Close your eyes and listen, is there a line? Try to feel it, search for it. And with the eyes open see what eyes see. Is there inside or outside here? Can you look inside? where is that?

"Strangely there seems to be some kind of center though." seems, that's right.. But is there? there is clear sensation of being. That which is aliveness, amness.  The buzzing vibrating something. Is that sensation there with or without labels?

Me is a label, no more.  Feeling, sensation is real, content of thought isn't.  

Anyway, this is what is in the way of seeing clearly "What do you expect from liberation?

I could give myself the ‘spiritual right answer’ but deep down I expect a lot of it.

The moment itself: a deep insight with all revealing light

Afterwards:

No more problems, they glide of like a fried egg in a Teflon pan

Deep peace

No more pain, worries and suffering

Always happy

Being profound and wise in every situation

Deep insight in life

Deep relaxation (my body always feels very tense and dense)

In short: I’m hoping to be special. I know it’s quite the opposite, but again that’s second hand knowledge (and now I’m thinking about it I even borrowed that second hand knowledge quote, everything I say about liberation seems something I picked up somewhere from others).  "

There is no insight. Just a drop of belief. No boom. That is shift in perception, can be very subtle. No more problems? Hm, may be or may not, depends on amount of beliefs need to burn and fall away. So leave this expectation right here. Deep peace yeah, can be accessed anytime, but not always present. 

No more pain? You are not going to turn into senseless zombie, pain, yes, suffering, it will diminish but won't evaporate overnight. This is only first step, there is integration and all that. Not the end, beginning. 

Happy? Irrelevant. It is not about state. Wise and profound? Who knows. It does not give you knowledge. This does not change character. Special? Definitely not. 

It is not what you expect, whatever you expect. So leave all expectations aside. Besides, the unfoldment is unique, no need to compare. Basically, mind is resolving this question and let it do it's job. Don't try to bend what is, look at what is already obvious.  Doubt all you know and ask what is true. 

Write to me what comes up.  

You are very very close.  Now look, everything so far is happening by itself.  One movement. Including thought about it. 

Much love. 

Ron:

Hi Ilona,

       

Thanks for your quick reply and for helping me out. I was really surprised when I opened my mail this morning and read your reply. It gave me some confidence to look further. Today I’ve spent the day outside the house working on your pointers. This is what was found:

There is no line between inside and outside. All you see is it. Close your eyes and listen, is there a line? Try to feel it, search for it.

When I close my eyes and try to find a line between outside and inside, I really can’t find one. It’s the most clear with sounds, I can’t find a boundary between the sound and the hearing itself. It’s like there is space in which everything happens, sound, hearing and what’s hearing at the same time.

Also thoughts don’t seem to be actually IN the head, they kind of fly trough.

Feelings like contractions are a bit more difficult. They seem to be in the body, but not very solid, more like floating in the body.

Bodily sensations like the wind touching the skin, don’t seem to have clear line either. It is hard to tell where the wind ends and the skin starts. It’s like they melting together.

So with closed eyes I can’t really find a hard or concrete line.

And with the eyes open see what eyes see. Is there inside or outside here?

With open eyes it was easy to find a line between inside and outside… in the beginning. But then something hit me. When I look I can’t tell where the seen ends and the eyes start. There is that big space (and small if I was not out in the woods but in a tiny room) in front of me in which everything happens, including my body. I can see the whole body except the head (that would need a mirror). Where my head should be is space.

The position of the body in that space determines the point of view, the direction of looking. And because I can’t see what’s happening behind me, it seems there is a boundary, but there isn’t. There is only a boundary or line when the I thought appears.

So also with my eyes open, I can’t find a line.

Is Inside and outside the same thing? I’m confused here

Can you look inside? where is that?

This is also a difficult one. I always find it hard to look inside. I can only do it with my eyes closed. Then it gets dark and spacious. The only thing I find are thoughts passing by. Thoughts about me. Sometimes there appear visuals of descending in the body, but this a thought also, isn’t it? Then I mostly stumble upon a feeling in the stomach area and can’t go any further.

I actually find nothing there. And I doubt now if there even is a inside there. Much confusion on this pointer too.

I’m still working on your other pointers.

By the way, I felt a bit lighter than I normally do. And there was some sadness about saying goodbye to my concepts about liberation. Overall I can say that writing to you about it is very helpful. It seems to clear things up. Until now I was always pondering about truth in my head.

Basically, mind is resolving this question and let it do it's job. 

Ilona, do you mean that mind is ‘working to’ liberation by itself? Like this is what mind is looking for?

Much thanks for your time so far. I'm looking forward to hear from you.

Gratitude and love,

Ron

Ilona:

Great to hear that it is helping to write to me. :) i love being of service.

> Ilona, do you mean that mind is ‘working to’ liberation by itself? Like this is what mind is looking for?

Yes, i mean exactly that. Thoughts about liberation and looking are happening, all by itself. There is no one here that is managing that. If you decide to drop all this and distract from inquiry, sure thing it will come back. Just like a seed sprouts and starts growing into a tree, so do ideas, they grow and there is no stopping that. So mind is looking for truth and seeing is happening, already. It is a process, sometimes shift is so subtle that can only be seen after a few days.

i sense that you are right at the gate, you are looking at it and starting to see the obvious.

keep me posted.
much love.

Ron:

Hi Ilona,

Things seem to unfold rapidly now, and there is a lot of clarity as in there is no gate, no such thing as liberation. These are all concepts, beliefs and ideas that keep you in imprisonment, seemingly. Even truth is a concept. IT doesn't need concepts; it doesn't need anything at all. IT JUST IS, it's already free and it always was. And even this description is too much. It can't be described, because it contains description and IT IS before description, or breath or whatever. It's no-thing and yet it appears to be everything.  

It's like mind is coming out of very uncomfortable and tensed position and relaxes. It's fluid and light as a feather.

The urge to find something is gone. The whole idea of searching exactly never was really there. It was already so, and therefore nothing really changes.

Ilona I'll come back to you soon to tell you more, but writing about is hard now because so much things are seen through rapidly. Yet it is a quite a peaceful and every day experience. This action figure called Ron just went to work like always, there is nothing special, but it's leaves you speechless   

It's like you said, it's nothing you can imagine.

Much, much, much love and gratitude,

Ron

Ilona:

Enjoy the ride, Ron! :) It really is something else when mind starts seeing through limitations that were here only because of words. 

I hear you and I know you have seen IT. Write to me when you feel like, I'll give you some last questions. 

Sending lots of love! 

Ron:

Hi Ilona,

The ride is great, it's amazing in it's simplicity. So here is a big smile from the Netherlands. Things are seen through, but in a pace that the action figure Ron can handle, because it couldn't be any different. There is this feeling of joy and peace as deep and spacious as the whole universe and at the same time it has the size of a speck of dust.

It's overwhelming but in a very laid back way.

Things literary have lost their weight or meaning, but not in a cold or nihilistic way. There is love and caring but without any attachment. I've expected this magical mystery tour topped off by a dark night of the soul, a crossing of the valley of death like some gurus say. And it's not like that at all. IT is utterly simple. But the urge to find meaning makes it seem so complex. All these books about IT, satsangs, gurus, caves, mountains with difficult names I've put so much meaning in are seen for what they are: empty, no-things. But as long as you give them meaning, there is no seeing. Maybe this why some gurus only wearing only a loin cloth to emphasize that. But a western mind thinks, oh look, he's wearing only a loin cloth, he must be special. And then people spend time with the guru in the hope to find truth.  But the guru is only pointing to truth, and of course 'he' is truth, but so is the seeker. And the guru is trying to tell you that, but he has no special powers so he's got to use what every other human uses, symbols, language, words, concepts. So then you get these paradoxal sentences like: emptiness is full, the pathless path, what's looking is what you’re looking for (love that one). And you think: wow that sounds cool, that sounds important. But these words are empty. Of course they carry some truth, but so does blahblahblah or dsfnsjgjsg.

With seeking comes meaning and then you build up these huge spiritual beliefs and so the walls of 'your cage' only thicken. The more you belief the thicker the 'wall'.

And those spiritual beliefs have another problem than other beliefs; they seem to be more important. So you start looking for things that fit that belief. Sitting for 20 years on a mountain top in India seems much more spiritual and effective than simply looking and writing and sending e-mails to you. A laptop doesn't seem to have the same halo as these images of Shiva the Destroyer have.  

But if you lucky you move from the 'big' gurus from India to ordinary guys like Paul Hedderman (if you don't know him, he's worth checking out on zenbitchslap.com) who talk about truth in a down to earth way. And your spiritual beliefs start to crumble. And if you are really lucky you find someone like you who takes time and says: have a look and tell me what you find.

Ilona you are amazing and I'm looking forward to the last questions.

Much much much love and gratitude,

Ron 

Ilona:

Thank you for kind words :) it was delightful to read your email. I love the sharing of fresh seeing, when the veil lifts and all that was hidden becomes obvious.  The meaning itself is the construct that helps to support the illusion- an image of me, searching for meaning is a very meaningful image. :)

And here are the final questions we ask when it's clear that the gate and the searcher have disappeared. 

Please answer in full when ready.  

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever? 

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

3) How does it feel to see this?

4) How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about this illusion but is curious about it.  

5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look? 

  

Lots of love to you too. 

My heart is filled with appreciation. 

Ron:

Hi Ilona,

Things settle more and more. It's like body and mind are adjusting to this 'new thing'. You are very effective in people helping to see. I can't find the words to express that gratitude. Maybe the answers on your last questions can be read as a big thank you to you, to life. 

Ilona, i'll keep you posted.

Much much much love, 

1) Is there a 'me', at all, anywhere, in any way, shape or form? Was there ever? 

No there isn't and there never was. Me, I, self are labels, words, symbols or whatever you want to call them. In reality you are not there. Have a look, you just got fooled. 

2) Explain in detail what the illusion of separate self is, when it starts and how it works.

I is the first symbol where everything else is 'built' on. After I come the rest of the words, symbols, concepts, beliefs etc. And you keep building and building and working on this I. Why? Because you think they are about you. You seems so important, interesting or cool. Literary everything you can think of is built on this little word 'I', a false assumption. Extremely tiny but also very persistent. Until you just take a look, than there is seeing that there never was an I in the first place. In a weird way deep down mind knows this and it's chasing down answers, but there are no answers, so it's get confused because it want's meaning or reason so badly while there isn't any of that. And mind just can't get or grasp it. Mind's nature is to divide so it can't understand wholeness. In that process of mind seeking for reason huge beliefs get made rather they material, spiritual, political, natural or anything you can possibly think of, and mind starts to giving them meaning by cherishing, hating, trading, loving, defending those beliefs. Whatever the belief is, they all start by the belief in I. But don't try to see through all those beliefs because they're endless. If you get rid of one idea, a 100 others come instead. The only belief that needs seeing through is that one word (beliefs are words) I. And if I is seen through all the other ones are gone too. And gone is not the right word, because they were never there anyway. 

3) How does it feel to see this?

Simple, normal, natural, every day and clear. Things loose their meaning, their weight, their sting. Because that sting is I, it is you. Things don't need a you. That is the reason a you was never here. IT doesn't need anything at all. IT JUST IS, like it was always. 

4) How would you describe it to somebody who has never heard about this illusion but is curious about it.  

Like the above. But don't put meaning in those words. The words are not it. They pointing, but in the end they are just a hideous attempt to describe something that can't be described. 

If you want to see IT, just sit down, look and write. Don't worry about looking honestly. Looking honesty and all that other stuff you think you need for simple looking are already there. Be like a Nike ad, just do it. Stop fancy about IT.  Just look and write and sooner or later that word 'I' will be written off. Just by itself. And then there is only living, only flowing, simply because it was already so. 

5) What was the last bit that pushed you over, made you look? 

Looking for the line between outside and inside. There was seeing that this line is not there, that I was that line, that boundary. After I was seen trough, everything was seen trough. Everything was about me, but me was not there. Me left everything and everything was left as it was always.

Ilona:

Thank you! Your words bring smile to my face an delight to my heart. 

i can see that you through the non-existing line with both legs. wooo hooo!

can i put this on my blog, so it may help somebody else and i could get you confirmed and invited to our facebook aftercare groups. (If you prefer, i can change the name.) some time sooner or later it is good to share experiences with others that seen the same, especially in times of falling- when beliefs are falling off so fast that there may be a bit help needed to stabilize.  there is a growing community on facebook, i'd love if you joined. If you do not have an account, create one. 

Ron:

Hi Ilona,

Of course you can put it on your blog. It is the least thing I can do to express gratitude. Thanx for all the info to, I'm not on Facebook, but I guess I will.

Ilona, many thanx for all you did, you are truly a life 'changer'. 

Much love, gratitude and a big hug,